YSSY Usable Spotting Locations - Decreasing?

[Terence W]

Hi All,

Sorry if this has been covered somewhere already. As I usually go spotting at first light I don't often bump into you guys, so don't have a chance to ask questions on where is good to go!

To me, it seems like Shep's Mound, Lady Robinson Beach, Foreshore Road and Swamp Road are now the only good spots. Am I wrong? I hope so!

I visited Barton Park Hill last year and it seemed to be underwhelming as the view to 07/25 was blocked by a raised roadway, and at Tempe Dog Park today, you'd need a very tall ladder to see over the tops of the trees. Someone mentioned on another post that there is a path from it but I couldn't see an entrance... Also at Swamp Road, I've seen people seemingly disappear at the fence on the top of the hill - am I missing something?

Even the vegetation at Lady Robinson Beach seems to have grown massively; one of the curious things I always wanted to know is if anyone had any trouble going right up to the fence?

Thanks all,

Terence.

[Kieran Wells]

Terrence, you can get right up next to the fence at the beach. Just remember to keep any ladders 3m back if you are using a ladder after taking your shot..

[Jason McQ]

I'm getting the feeling that long lenses are now starting to become the norm around the airport. We are loosing ground bit by bit.

[Sarah C]

Small bump to this thread.........I have seen all the construction sheds and equipment in front of the mound in recent times. Does this mean that getting a shot of the aircraft (unless they rotate on 34L by the M5) is near impossible?

[NathanJ]

Won't be long before the whole tower mound / bus & rental car sites are redeveloped and will be but a memory... Works are well in advance for what i'm assuming are new standoff bays near the southern end of the long term car park. (see attached photo)

[Grahame Hutchison]

From what I have heard, the Federal Government has told the SACL to install an electric fence around the complete perimeter of the airport. Work already appears to be underway along the DOM5 and DOM6 boundary.

[Nigel C]

Won't be long before the whole tower mound / bus & rental car sites are redeveloped and will be but a memory... Works are well in advance for what i'm assuming are new standoff bays near the southern end of the long term car park. (see attached photo)

There are 2 Code E (or up to 5 Code C) stand-off bays being developed there, with entry off Twy Charlie via an extension of Twy Kilo. I believe they may come online sometime around mid-December.

[NathanJ]

Nice... Thanks for the update Nigel. :D

[Brian Wilkes]

If someone could post a few pics of the rubbish thats impeding the view at sheps mound would be appreciated!

[Nigel C]

Brian, it's just site sheds using the compound at the bottom of Shep's Mound. I'd presume they'll be there for the duration of the perimeter fence upgrade works that Grahame mentioned. Looking south from Shep's Mound, there's the line of casuarina trees blocking much/most of the view towards the 34L threshold, but they've been growing there for years.

[Grahame Hutchison]

Hi Brian, Have a look at the Panospheres I have been creating lately, there is one of The Mound taken only a week or so ago.

The others so far are The Beach and Port Botany Launching Ramp. The spheres take advantage of Pan & Tilt on smartphones to look around the image.

You can look left, right, up and down, as well as zoom in and out, and there are hyperlinks to points of interest at the bottom of the screen.

16Right Panospheres (http://panosphere.16right.com)

[Brian Wilkes]

Thanks Nigel & Grahame. Grahame I've been following your pics and yes I have seen what your going through in case of tying to take unobstructed view photo's on Sheps mound!

P.S yeah thanks again Grahame just had a look at your link. Ill up in Feb and hope it don't get worse!
Thanks all again!

[Mick F]

While it's always going to be a shame to lose spotting areas, from the perspective of someone who operates from this airport all the time, any development of the airport as an airport is more than welcome! It is by far the least user friendly airport in Australia in its present form.

Bring on Badgerys Creek!

Mick

[Nigel C]

'Least user friendly'? How so?

[Mick F]

More the layout of the terminals Nige. If you're unlucky enough to get pipped by another aircraft for a pushback out of T2 there, then having to wait for inbound aircraft, you can be left waiting for up to 15-20 minutes (that's my record) before you're allowed to push!

The taxiway layout around the T2 area as well could be very easy for someone unfamiliar with it, to get the wrong taxiway.

It's not the most efficient layout, put it that way.

Mick

[Morris Biondi]

Not to mention the ridiculous movements cap and inefficient use of runways.

We all welcome development at the airport, but it's terminal gates that are needed now not in 20 years, as well as hardstands.

I've read in the master plan that the re-alignment of taxyway Bravo and charlie will take place to handle code F aircraft movements independently, this is good news, hopefully it will happen sooner rather than later.

But most importantly rwy 34R/16L needs to be utilised mostly for arrivals except for code F aircraft and rwy 34L/16R for departures, hence it's longer length. The directional system in place at the moment is very inefficient. With the extension of bravo till the end of 34L this should make it easier to be applied.

I've spoken to many people around the airport about this, just about all agree this would be a much better system.

[Nigel C]

I agree the taxiway layout is pretty complex in that spot (Twy's Charlie-2, Bravo-4, Dom-2, Charlie, Golf for anyone who isn't sure of where we mean, see attached pics), and I know it's an area that's fairly well tested for people getting taxiway driving authority's.

If you had the option of changing it from it's 2010 layout Mick, what would you have suggested?

2010...
http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x82/Kiska2/Sydney%202010_zpsom43cqjk.jpg

2015...
http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x82/Kiska2/Sydney%20today_zpsr3dr0stw.jpg

[Mick F]

Personally, I think B4 running diagonally there should be done away with. That would make it a lot easier just by doing that!

But it's also the terminal layout that is the biggest problem. Probably fine when it was built for Ansett back in the day, but it can be a nightmare some days.

Mick

[Matthew Chisholm]

From what I have heard, the Federal Government has told the SACL to install an electric fence around the complete perimeter of the airport.

That's gotta hurt when the ladder touches the fence :eek:

[Nigel C]

I guess it will make it easy to see who the culprit is. :)

[Grahame Hutchison]

Here is an update on the new fence construction at DOM5, DOM6 and around to the Helipads. The black vertical supports for the new fencing look to be super
strong "I" beams. I am assuming that the actual fencing material is the same as on Qantas Drive and the Virgin Cargo areas, see through, but not for
photography. There will be three strands of electrified wires along the top. At the end of the DOM5 and DOM6 Aprons, the fence height reduces by about a
third, presumably because there are no parked aircraft inside the fence.

http://www.16right.com/MessageBoard/D300-20151120-026.jpg

http://www.16right.com/MessageBoard/D300-20151120-027.jpg

http://www.16right.com/MessageBoard/D300-20151120-028.jpg

[Robert.M]

I see what you mean about the Qantas Drive fencing. :( DOM5 and 6 are my favourite spots.

[Grahame Hutchison]

Here are a couple of images I picked up yesterday of the new Apron just north of the Tower and The Mound.

The poles are already in place for the electric fence - it's looking quite close to completion
http://www.16right.com/MessageBoard/D300-20151128-002.jpg

http://www.16right.com/MessageBoard/D300-20151128-003.jpg

[Bob C]

Appears similar to the fence we've had in Perth for nearly 5 years. That really took the joy away from spotting/photography and the old fence has not been removed in some areas so we have two fences to contend with, only a metre or so apart.

[Bob C]

But we do have a wonderful Viewing Area on the approach to Runway 03 which more than compensates and is hugely popular with spotters and the general public.

[Greg McDonald]

Unfortunately Sydney Airport doesn't give a rat's **** about spotters and never has!

[James P Warner]

But we do have a wonderful Viewing Area on the approach to Runway 03 which more than compensates and is hugely popular with spotters and the general public.

An area that's ONLY usable when 03 is in use AND in the afternoon. Oh and most stuff doesn't venture down to the full length.

If you're found anywhere else around the airport you're told to bugger off to that spot as it's the "only official location".

[Kurt A]

Unfortunately Sydney Airport doesn't give a rat's **** about spotters

Greg, fair crack. Fence serves a purpose greater than spotters concern, and you know that. It's an airport after all.

and never has!

Not true! Especially after SACL's proactive inclusion of Spotters exclusively from this very forum over the past 3-5 years regarding numerous airside spotting tours and even airside access to select airline events. Something that potentially could continue in the future. Keep positive!



Btw, too long between drinks, how was your cruise and Hawaii?

[James P Warner]

SACL's proactive inclusion of Spotters exclusively from this very forum

Case and point!

Whilst I don't disagree with the fence going up for "airport operational reasons" some more consideration could be given to spotters. The mound was the only suitable place for a construction compound? The airport is a big place!

[Greg McDonald]

Greg, fair crack. Fence serves a purpose greater than spotters concern, and you know that. It's an airport after all.

That's true and of course security must come well and truly first. I was referring to the efforts you see a lot of major airports around the world putting into official spotting areas and parks etc. Sydney airport has made absolutely NO effort to accomodate spotters in this regard and have shown no wish to.

And Hawaii and especially Tahiti were incredible...would do it again tomorrow!

[Bob C]

Correct James but there other places around Perth airport that are excellent in the morning and afternoon whichever runway is in use - seek and you shall find. And in more than 27 years spotting in Perth, I have never been told to b....r off or go to the official location. Be thankful for the Viewing Area - people are lobbying to have it upgraded and I believe there are plans for another elsewhere.

[Bob C]

Hi Greg - not correct. Kurt will probably recall that SACL / Federal Police were considering a formal spotting location a couple of years ago at Sydney Airport and asked for input from subscribers to this board. I submitted a lengthy email to FedPol regarding the relationship Perth spotters have with the airport authorities and also mentioned that a Viewing Area has just opened at Perth Airport - December 2011 I think so I thought that would have give them some ideas. However, afaik, nothing ever eventuated with the Sydney proposal. I kept my email to FedPol for sometime but deleted it earlier this year.

[Greg McDonald]

So therefore it IS correct Bob. They asked for proposals and you replied and have heard nothing in 4 years....I think that says it all!!

[Scott L.]

They (SACL) are not likely to do anything unless it could be built and operated at a decent margin and profit with returns in less than one or two years - or even less.

I do think they care but the business case for other uses is far more compelling than us spotters.

However, so we have so far lost the observation deck, the bus tour and now we're losing or having viewing opportunities disrupted with nothing to look forward to and a lot to still lose.

So whilst some would say they have done nothing what they could do is consider committing to something more permanent.

[Bob C]

Greg did say that......" Sydney airport has made absolutely NO effort to accomodate spotters in this regard and have shown no wish to....." And Kurt, hasn't SACL been active with Aministrators of this Board on other matters ?

I thought Greg's statement untrue because some effort had been made, albeit never proceeded with. But let's drop the battle of semantics.

I'll continue to enjoy the Viewing Area at Perth airport whenever I can and hope that one day Sydney spotters will be able to enjoy similar facilities.

[Mick F]

I'd rather have the money spent on infrastructure projects to be honest, but that's just my opinion as a user of the airport.

Mick

[Martin Buzzell]

Gawd, hope they never stop people parking at the end of 34 in Melbourne.

[Stephen Brown]

I'd rather have the money spent on infrastructure projects to be honest, but that's just my opinion as a user of the airport.

Mick

Pffffttt, who'd ever use an airport to land planes at....

[Werner K]

Gawd, hope they never stop people parking at the end of 34 in Melbourne.

I'll agree with that. My partner & I recently went to Melbourne and spent the entire day there. It's a great spot.