2nd Full Service InterCity Carrier in Australia?

[Arthur T]

Since Ansett's failure, until now, QANTAS is the only full service carrier offering Economy Class 1 piece 32kg Free Luggage Allowance, Full Customer Service, Free Newspapers, Free Headphones and Inflight Magazines + Entertainment and Free Meals On Board plus Drinks. Offering frequent flights bewteen major Australian cities.

For other carriers, all above services need to be charged. That's make QANTAS is monopoly in Australian Domestic Market, and that QANTAS can charge customers extremely high price also a market follower, don't initiate market towards prices.

Due to its lack of competition, I really really really afraid with rise of oil prices and costs, QANTAS can further cut their full service as those others doing thus suffering all Australian commuters.

Frankly, from my point of view, I don't understand why commuters would choose Low Cost Carriers such as JetStar and Virgin Blue make them that popular where what they are providing to commuters in Australia is totally rubbish, and even more expensive if you choose to have all of their add-on service, and their add-on services such as food on board or entertainment etc is no better than Qantas.

(I don't know why Virgin Blue or JetStar is not offering a full big meal like steak or pancakes, hamburgers on short flights like an hour or two which I would really happy to have it, as it is what QF J Class is doing, and I can just pay $20/30 for it.)

Adhere, I really want to raise to see if we are going to have another Full Service Carrier to compete with QANTAS in its CityFlyer service that we can push and maintain the quality of QANTAS:

1. Possibility for Virgin Blue to convert to a full service carrier and offers Economy Class passengers Free 23kg Bag Allowance
2. Possibility for Air New Zealand to open Australian Domsetic Route as what JetConnect is doing in NZ
3. Possibility for relaunching Ansett Australia, a member of Star Alliance, offering full service to customers and frequent intercity service.
4. Possibility for a brand new Full Service Carrier in Australia, rather than those rubbish budget ones.

Thank you and hope to hear your comment shortly.

[Michael Mak]

Because there is no need to have a big steak with chips for an hour flight. Many commuters are more than happy to save $$ on things that they don't need and fly for a lot less than what QF offers. I'm more than happy to go without food and drink for that 1-2 hours flight and save on $$. Really who needs to eat a full meal when flying SYD-MEL?

Airlines like DJ and JQ offer a choice for their customers, not everyone would want or need meals, drinks or entertainment. I do agree with you that charging for check-in luggage is going to far but I'm happy to live with that for how much I could save to fly with DJ/JQ.

[David C]

It's all well and good having full service at full service price when someone else is paying for your ticket ... like your boss for example , but when you pay for your own ticket , the bottom line is the cost . I'm flying Birmingham to Shannon and return in 2 weeks time . I could have flown Aer Lingus , but I chose Ryan Air , why ?? .... 10 pounds return inc. tax and all charges thats why .. I can do without food and drink for an hour .

Dave C

[Radi K]

It was called OzJet Mk I. It came, It went...

What I think you will see if QF slowly pulling back their product to match VB. For the sake of cost. The full service products they keep will be only in select high yielding markets. I don't blame them. It's a monopoly at the top end but it's just economics 101.

What would be great (but the market could never sustain it) is a product like Virgin America in oz.

[D Chan]

For other carriers, all above services need to be charged. That's make QANTAS is monopoly in Australian Domestic Market, and that QANTAS can charge customers extremely high price also a market follower, don't initiate market towards prices.

The question is then, why do other carriers charge for these services? - product differentiation. The notion that all customers are the same is wrong. Perhaps other carriers don't want to add complexities to their business model and unnecessary items that will ultimately drive up their 'unit cost' per seat. Secondly, they don't want to make some of their customers pay for what may be unnecessary to them. e.g. not all travellers need the 32kg travel allowance and not all passengers would want IFE for 1 hour flights e.g. reading a book or a nap to them is just as good.

Frankly, from my point of view, I don't understand why commuters would choose Low Cost Carriers such as JetStar and Virgin Blue make them that popular where what they are providing to commuters in Australia is totally rubbish, and even more expensive if you choose to have all of their add-on service, and their add-on services such as food on board or entertainment etc is no better than Qantas.

Ok, I don't know how many commuters out there would choose a LCC and pay for all the extras that are available to them. I think the % of such passengers are VERY VERY low. It probably is more expensive if you choose to have all their add-on service because these carriers have worked out the amount of commuters who would opt for all the extras are very low. They would therefore want to get more revenue from each add-on item (ancillary revenues).

[Will T]

What I think you will see if QF slowly pulling back their product to match VB. For the sake of cost.


I don't think you'll see that happen at all, Radi. For the reasons I outlined on the other thread (and a number of others), VB - its product, positioning and strategy - is the last place the QF Group wants to be.

Unfortunately, and for obvious reasons, I'm not in a position to go into much detail on this. But I'm sure (and hope) there'll be a number of interesting responses to this thread.

[Eli B]

Do LCC's have a faretype that allows a commuter to arrive early at the airport and get on a flight earlier then their booked one? (Or later?) Of course it is up to availability, but in my experience men and women in suits are always doing this. There is a big rush for Friday afternoon flights when meetings run late or finish early. Do LCC's have the frequency for a commuter to take advantage of this faretype? I'm sorry I havent done the research cos im not a commuter... but its just a thought.

(If only Sydney's Cityrail had a Frequent Sardine System I would be saving BIG BUCKS!)

[Gareth U]

Free Luggage Allowance, Full Customer Service, Free Newspapers, Free Headphones and Inflight Magazines

Free Luggage Allowance
Virgin matches Qantas' 32kg at comparable fare levels to those charges by the full service carrier.

Full Customer Service
I am yet to travel a LCC and only receive partial customer service. What is your definition? I flew flybe and tuifly (both LCC) in Europe recently and their customer service from check-in to onboard was second to none. Cabin crew were extremely professional, courteous and their service was refined (offering ice and lemon with drinks, water during a ground delay etc.). I would go as far to say that inflight service levels were much higher than the other airlines we used (Qantas, ANA, Cathay).

Closer to home my experiences flying Jetstar in recent times the cabin crew are just as accommodating (perhaps moreso on a consistency scale) than those at Qantas can be.

Free Newspapers
Only offered by Qantas on certain routes/times.

Free Headphones
Virgin offer free headphones.

Inflight Magazine
Offered by all carriers.

With respect to catering. Many would argue that they prefer the choice offered at the LCCs (or to BYO or eat before/after the flight) rather than being given two biscuits or just a sandwich of the airline's choosing.

[Jack B]

really not worth it, especially when you actually get the meal that cost you extra. wheras, virgin blue sells really really good chicken wraps. so for domestic, if your paying for yourself DJ is a better option in my opinion.

and i really dont think QF does steak on SYD-MEL flights.

[David Knudsen]

Because there is no need to have a big steak with chips for an hour flight.

I disagree! What a concept...BBQ Airways! I'd be onboard!

[Arthur T]

Free Luggage Allowance
Virgin matches Qantas' 32kg at comparable fare levels to those charges by the full service carrier.

Full Customer Service
....

Free Newspapers
Only offered by Qantas on certain routes/times.

Free Headphones
Virgin offer free headphones.

Inflight Magazine
Offered by all carriers.

With respect to catering. Many would argue that they prefer the choice offered at the LCCs (or to BYO or eat before/after the flight) rather than being given two biscuits or just a sandwich of the airline's choosing.

Luggage Allowance:
Even I pay $8 to DJ, I can only get 23kg allowance and others I need to pay heaps. If I am going for a big trip and have more than 23kg, they would be much stricter than QF and need you to pay for it. My friend comes from Townsville to Sydney and take Jetstar and made her to pay for just 2/3 kg above 20kg allowance.
I believe even you exceed 2/3 kg allowance on a QF flight they will let them through as my experience on a Dash 8 with a 23kg bag.
If LCC offers passengers a choice, they must make a choice of prepaying $18 for 32kg bag rather $8 for 23kg or even $10 for 20kg only.

Customer Service
I believe the CS of JetStar would be more rigid than full service like Qantas do. Think about how much time you arrive airport before departure.
QF flights only requires you to arrive 15 mins (with No checked luggage) or 30 mins (with checked luggage), where JQ and DJ need you to waste 15 - 30 minutes more to wait at the airport, as they requires 45 minute arrival.
My another friend just travelled JQ to AVV from SYD, he forgot to get his boarding pass to board and struggled a lot to get the boarding pass finally. Think about Qantas, I saw many people didn't get their boarding pass until they reach the gates and take it from the CS Counter.

Customer Service think means ground staff service. Think QF can give you much better Ground service, more flexible and give you less stressed for a flight, as most services are done for you.

Inflight Service

I took Virgin Blue once as a Qantas Replacement Service. The flight attendants (as well as I see around the airport) by LCCs looks younger and more beautiful, attractive, sexy and charming to both guys and girls than those on Qantas. But think the experience and maturity on Qantas FAs can give a safe feeling to passengers on board, especially they can cater child really well.

I just flown on QF624 to Brissie and the FAs babysit for the baby around the 738 aircraft. Do you think you can just relax and have FA babysit for your baby on JQ/DJ?

Yes, DJ has free headphones, but that is not noise cancelling as what is offered on QF flights. Why DJ don't just sell a better headphones then?

Meals on Board

I agree that QF does not cater their passengers so well, just a few biscuits or cake on board doesn't make me feel full. LCC offers passengers a choice whether or not to eat, but I think they must offer choice to passengers to have much better food, otherwise there is no point to take LCCs. (For eg. I would rather to buy pinkles on Coles before heading off to the airport than to buy it inflight, but I would expect for at least a small piece of fish with rice on LCC.)

I don't agree you don't need to eat or drink for 1 hr flight, because you already spent another hour waiting to board and collecting luggage, furthermore you need anotehr hour to travel to and from the airport. Airport food are really expensive. (The Wok on Air sells stir-flies 100 - 150% more expensive than those offering in the city) So you see inflight food is really important. And how about water? You cannot bring water from outside, water in the terminal costs you $3.20/bottle. If your carrier even can't give you water for free, then you would really thristy and not good for health inflight for a hour or two and feel bad after the flight.

Generally, LCC is a good idea, they offer much cheaper fully flexiable fares and more importantly, cheaper Business Class seats that offers commuters more comfort in a cheaper price and a choice. As a result, I would expect a much higher add-on service standards on LCCs, where they cannot provide such to us, think a 2nd full service carrier would be a solution.

[Eli B]

The idea of having LCC's in Australia was to cater for a different type of passenger. QF and JQ are a team. Together they capture a large % of market share (sorry i couldnt find numbers)

Which way are DJ going to go? LCC or Full Service? Or both? It seems to me they are trying to cover both bases with the introduction of Premium Economy on top of their loyalty programs, Lounges etc. How good a job they are doing remains to be seen. Perhaps with the entry of Tiger, Virgin Blue may break free of their LCC model. Is it possible to fully transition?

Is there room for another Full Service Domestic Airline? It seems there wasnt enough room for OzJet. All the business ventures since the entry of Virgin Blue, excluding OzJet have been LCC - even after we said farewell to Ansett (r.i.p).(please correct me if I have missed an airline startup!)


Investors will risk money where there has been significant research to help them make a decision. Perhaps the fact that we have only seen OzJet attempt this hard task means that Australia can no longer sustain 2 Full Service Domestic Airlines? It doesnt mean that the numbers havent been worked on... we will never know!

[Justin L]

Do LCC's have a faretype that allows a commuter to arrive early at the airport and get on a flight earlier then their booked one? (Or later?) Of course it is up to availability, but in my experience men and women in suits are always doing this. There is a big rush for Friday afternoon flights when meetings run late or finish early. Do LCC's have the frequency for a commuter to take advantage of this faretype? I'm sorry I havent done the research cos im not a commuter... but its just a thought.

(If only Sydney's Cityrail had a Frequent Sardine System I would be saving BIG BUCKS!)

Wouldn't fully flexible fares on DJ and JQ allow them to do this? They are more expensive than their discount fares, but still cheaper than QF's fully flexible fares.

[Arthur T]

Wouldn't fully flexible fares on DJ and JQ allow them to do this? They are more expensive than their discount fares, but still cheaper than QF's fully flexible fares.

That's my point, DJ and JQ's advantage is to provide cheaper business class seats whilst the service unchanged from QANTAS, which think is a great threat to QF's J seats.

DJ's flexible fares works quite well, but I don't think JQ works on their JetFlex, think about their rubbish frequency, I don't think a traveller would be any benefical from JQ's JetFlex fares.

There is no point to take JQ unless QF's fare is > JQ if you are a QF FF Member.

Opps that makes another point, JQ's FF Programme which is really awful, except you need to pay very expensively for a JetFlex for 1000 QF FF Points, which no one will do it. DJ's Velocity is really weird, I doubt how they can integrate themselves into any alliance in a near future with such a weird FF Programme.

I really recoknd JQ MUST giver 250/500 points to QF FF Members for JetSaver Fare + 5/10 Status Credits Minimum.
I cannot tolerate QF FF coomuters need to pay $229 for 1000 Points + SCs for a Brisbane - Proserpine One Way.

One more thing, on QF flights, FAs will give you a pillow and blanket, cover you well and ensure you have a great sleep with them, but can DJ/JQ do that for FREE?

[Marty H]

Think a few people on this thread are living in a 1980's TAA/Ansett fantasy land.

Airline travel used to be something with a bit of class, exculsive to people who were well off on business etc, people paid big money and expected fine serivce, crockery, cutlery you name it.

Something, somewhere clicked and we now have LCC's that now allow almost everyone the affordablity to fly, isnt that better for the travelling public???? Arent there now more people flying than ever before, they now have choice on what they want food/drink, TV and seating, majority of the time they get to their destination on time and all the time are there safely, thats what people want now, I mean from my opinion I dont need to have a full on meal on a 1-2hr sector, I might buy a drink but generally eat nothing and eat prior to boarding at the airport or at home, people are still in the mindset 'ohh Im getting on a plane they will feed me', airlines are there to transport you now on time and safely, I mean in your ticket price thats all your paying for anyway with a LCC.

People need to go with the times and accept change and evolve, three LCC's operatin gin Australia have proven that is what Australians want.

[Marty H]

That's my point, DJ and JQ's advantage is to provide cheaper business class seats whilst the service unchanged from QANTAS, which think is a great threat to QF's J seats.

DJ's flexible fares works quite well, but I don't think JQ works on their JetFlex, think about their rubbish frequency, I don't think a traveller would be any benefical from JQ's JetFlex fares.

There is no point to take JQ unless QF's fare is > JQ if you are a QF FF Member.

Opps that makes another point, JQ's FF Programme which is really awful, except you need to pay very expensively for a JetFlex for 1000 QF FF Points, which no one will do it. DJ's Velocity is really weird, I doubt how they can integrate themselves into any alliance in a near future with such a weird FF Programme.

I really recoknd JQ MUST giver 250/500 points to QF FF Members for JetSaver Fare + 5/10 Status Credits Minimum.
I cannot tolerate QF FF coomuters need to pay $229 for 1000 Points + SCs for a Brisbane - Proserpine One Way.

One more thing, on QF flights, FAs will give you a pillow and blanket, cover you well and ensure you have a great sleep with them, but can DJ/JQ do that for FREE?

How is it weird:confused: You get one point per $1 spent, you can reclaim your points on any flight on any day at anytime, surely that isnt rocket science???

[Sarah C]

Think a few people on this thread are living in a 1980's TAA/Ansett fantasy land.

Airline travel used to be something with a bit of class, exculsive to people who were well off on business etc, people paid big money and expected fine serivce, crockery, cutlery you name it.

Something, somewhere clicked and we now have LCC's that now allow almost everyone the affordablity to fly, isnt that better for the travelling public???? Arent there now more people flying than ever before, they now have choice on what they want food/drink, TV and seating, majority of the time they get to their destination on time and all the time are there safely, thats what people want now, I mean from my opinion I dont need to have a full on meal on a 1-2hr sector, I might buy a drink but generally eat nothing and eat prior to boarding at the airport or at home, people are still in the mindset 'ohh Im getting on a plane they will feed me', airlines are there to transport you now on time and safely, I mean in your ticket price thats all your paying for anyway with a LCC.

People need to go with the times and accept change and evolve, three LCC's operatin gin Australia have proven that is what Australians want.

Well said Marty. Australians have a choice and the fact that all 4 carriers are successful shows that the mix is right.

[Michael Morrison]

.

Inflight Service

I just flown on QF624 to Brissie and the FAs babysit for the baby around the 738 aircraft.
.....

Yes, DJ has free headphones, but that is not noise cancelling as what is offered on QF flights. Why DJ don't just sell a better headphones then?.

Ok - firstly, you should never expect an FA to babysit your child.

Re Headphones, QF don't have noise cancelling headphones in Y on domestic routes....so how can you compare?

They don't even have them on international Y.

[Michael Morrison]

DJ's Velocity is really weird, I doubt how they can integrate themselves into any alliance in a near future with such a weird FF Programme.

Why is their program weird?

Air NZ have a program whereby you earn Air bucks at strange rates, but they still fit into a global alliance.

Also if you look at how you earn/redeem velocity miles with airline partners, I can't see how it would be different for alliance partners.

[Michael Morrison]

Do LCC's have a faretype that allows a commuter to arrive early at the airport and get on a flight earlier then their booked one?

It depends on the LCC.

In Australia, DJ do have multiple frequencies on business routes and do have fares that allow last minute changes, though obviously you pay more for that.

In Europe, Easyjet which is also a LCC offers as good a frequency on certain business routes and also offer flexibility to change to an earlier/later flight if needed. So Yes, LCC's do offer these types of things... but only the ones that focus on business routes.

[Gareth U]

I cannot tolerate QF FF coomuters need to pay $229 for 1000 Points + SCs for a Brisbane - Proserpine One Way.

Then you can pay the $300-$400 each way you used to pay when QFLink was on the route. Simple.

One more thing, on QF flights, FAs will give you a pillow and blanket, cover you well and ensure you have a great sleep with them, but can DJ/JQ do that for FREE?

I am a Qantas FA and have never seen any FA cover any customer with a blanket or anything else, for that matter! Sure they are available on request - until they run out - but that's where it ends.

Did you know there is only 20 blankets on a 737 and only 30 on a 767 for domestic flights? So get in quick, Arthur ;)

Don't even get me started on babysitting! :mad:

Oh, and regarding baggage allowance. At the higher fare levels, similar to Flexible Qantas fares, Virgin Blue has a 32kg allowance. You just have to be willing to spend more than the cheapest available fare, Arthur! :confused:

[Ash W]

It's all well and good having full service at full service price when someone else is paying for your ticket ... like your boss for example , but when you pay for your own ticket , the bottom line is the cost . I'm flying Birmingham to Shannon and return in 2 weeks time . I could have flown Aer Lingus , but I chose Ryan Air , why ?? .... 10 pounds return inc. tax and all charges thats why .. I can do without food and drink for an hour .

Dave C

Ironicly Aer Lingus is itself now a LLC, except in long haul. You pay extra for your bags, for seat allocation (when travelling together this is a good lurk for them) and for food.

As for the orginal post, in Australia we have always been spoilt with service. Sure Qantas has the full service end of the market to themselves but they are far from a monopoly. We have, in most markets quite a lot of choice and as somone who travels quite a lot around different parts of the world we still have much better sevice than elsewhere.

[Michael Mak]

One more thing, on QF flights, FAs will give you a pillow and blanket, cover you well and ensure you have a great sleep with them, but can DJ/JQ do that for FREE?
That didn't happen when I flew with QF on SYD-MEL (on an international sector which by the way service was ordinary, nothing special. The only reason I forked out the extra $40 was because A330-300 and visited the international terminals of both ends), CNS-SYD, SYD-ADL.

[Philip Argy]

I tried DJ's "Premium Economy" on a return trip to BNK last week. In seat 1A on VBC I had no IFE screen to watch and there was not so much as a free cup of tea or a cup of water. And as for the extra legroom, my left leg was actually cramped by the bulge in the cabin door for the escape slide! (I had to put my feet under my seat when the crew were arming or disarming the slide as they would othewise have been in the way.)

The return trip in seat 1F had a screen to view but not sure why it was designated an exit row since the nearest exit was on the other side of the partition in the galley.

And the 7kg carry-on limit is ridiculous, especially when most crew take offence when I point out that my laptop is permitted in addition to the 7kg (at least as I read DJ's rules).

Based on my experience, 'premium' only meant that my client paid more for me to sit in a wider leather seat. So 'premium, my a*se!' seems to be the most appropriate way of signifying my agreement that we are a long way from seeing a second full service carrier in the Australian market. If we could unwind the past and have let SQ take over Ansett when they first wanted to we would all be much better off today. Air NZ pillaged AN both physically and financially and they get no support from me any more. :eek:

[Ash W]

I...

If we could unwind the past and have let SQ take over Ansett when they first wanted to we would all be much better off today. Air NZ pillaged AN both physically and financially and they get no support from me any more. :eek:

Your response should say if News Limited had let SQ take over SQ, not 'we'. Afterall Ansett was a private company owned at the time by News.

Oh don't feel too bad, I travel BA business class quite a lot in Europe and it sounds about the same as Virgin Blue premium. The only difference is on BA you get a free feed and some drink, but at a price premium of 2-3 times the cost of Y. Makes for one expensive meal.

[damien b]

I for one am glad that the likes of DJ appeared in our skies and made flying affordable. Who cares if you don't get a meal with your flight or that the seats don't allow you to stretch out and sleep. Its a domestic flight and excluding the long flights between Perth and the East Coast, 2 hours isn't that long to be on a plane.

I spend 90 minutes a day one way on a train to go to work with less room at times than what you get in economy class. Okay i dont pay as much but i don't go as far either.

If you desire business class - fly QF, otherwise DJ and JQ will do most people.

[Arthur T]

Re: Garath U

Hope it hasn't make you angry about babysitting. :o

And thanks for that, I can always get a pillow on my flights, thanks.
Think I had made a mistake that that is SQ/CX will cover blanket for the commuters, but why QF crew don't do that?

I believe DJ would offer Corp Plus or Flexable passengers 32kg allowance, but that is really much more expensive than QF to offer 32kg for just a little bit more than DJ's fare. Perhaps a passenger with 32kg luggage can only fly QF for cheap fares then.

Thanks for your information about Prosperine, think I can't complain then whilst QF's CNS - HTI is $221 the cheapest.

I for one am glad that the likes of DJ appeared in our skies and made flying affordable. Who cares if you don't get a meal with your flight or that the seats don't allow you to stretch out and sleep. Its a domestic flight and excluding the long flights between Perth and the East Coast, 2 hours isn't that long to be on a plane.

I spend 90 minutes a day one way on a train to go to work with less room at times than what you get in economy class. Okay i dont pay as much but i don't go as far either.

If you desire business class - fly QF, otherwise DJ and JQ will do most people.

How about JQ's StarClass? I read their ads about StarClass and think there is no difference with QF's W Class with a Y Class Fare! Sounds attractive! Is that possible for JQ to launch StarClass on all Domestic Flights actually to beat DJ?

[Rhys Xanthis]

Not going to happen.

There isnt a great deal of space on the A320 to begin with, and JQ are, and always have, marketed themselves as a low budget option - you wont see many business people flying JQ when QF is an option.

[Ash W]

Re: Garath U
...
And thanks for that, I can always get a pillow on my flights, thanks.
Think I had made a mistake that that is SQ/CX will cover blanket for the commuters, but why QF crew don't do that?
...

Mate compare apples with apples. SQ/CX are long haul international carriers. On Qantas long haul you get a pillow and blanket. On domestic they (normally) have a small amount on board and will give them out when asked.

You can say how crap that is, but the reality is things like this cost money and were one of the first things to go to bring down costs so that Qantas could better compete with the LLC's on fares.

[Michael Mak]

And thanks for that, I can always get a pillow on my flights, thanks.
Think I had made a mistake that that is SQ/CX will cover blanket for the commuters, but why QF crew don't do that? QF international indeed offers pillow and blanket but they don't that for domestic flights unless upon request.

How about JQ's StarClass? I read their ads about StarClass and think there is no difference with QF's W Class with a Y Class Fare! Sounds attractive! Is that possible for JQ to launch StarClass on all Domestic Flights actually to beat DJ?How can one justify the cost of installing StarClass on the A320 at the expanse of other Y class seat? How many JQ customers would fly on StarClass when they fly SYD-AVV, SYD-OOL-, BNE-ROK, MEL-HBA? JQ's customers are price-sensitive, they want the cheapest possible fare, not after any fenzy products. If people really want to receive Business Class service, JQ is not their choice.chrome://dictionarytip/skin/book.png

[Rhys Xanthis]

They provide everyone blankets and pillows on the overnight Perth-East Coast legs.

[Gareth U]

QF international indeed offers pillow and blanket but they don't that for domestic flights unless upon request.

How can one justify the cost of installing StarClass on the A320 at the expanse of other Y class seat? How many JQ customers would fly on StarClass when they fly SYD-AVV, SYD-OOL-, BNE-ROK, MEL-HBA?

To add to Ryan's post yes, pillows and blankets are preset at 100% in Y/C on the first and last flight of the day from MEL and SYD to PER (and CBR-PER) and all night flights PER-MEL/SYD/BNE. J/C should have them loaded at 100% but on day sectors the blankets are stowed above, rather than preset on seats.

SYD-DRW-SYD and CNS-PER-CNS on the night flights pillows and blankets are also loaded at 100% in both cabins.

On Tasman / Noumea flights pillows and blankets are loaded at 100% in J/C and about 50% in Y/C.

Apologies for the thread drift!

Regarding StarClass on domestic, I think it it could work by removing 1 row of seats and increasing the legroom to 34" for the first six or so rows. StarClass could also offer the centre seat free with movable armrests. The manufacturer of JQ's current seat, Brice, also makes convertible seats. When not being used for StarClass (and I agree it would not suit all flights/routes), Jetstar could sell the seats as extra legroom seats. I think it could work - and Jetstar, I believe, have proven to be quite adaptive when it comes to maximising revenue and custom.

[Gareth U]

I tried DJ's "Premium Economy"...there was not so much as a free cup of tea or a cup of water.

And the 7kg carry-on limit is ridiculous, especially when most crew take offence when I point out that my laptop is permitted in addition to the 7kg (at least as I read DJ's rules).

I was amazed when DJ announced this product that it did not include some sort of complimentary food and drink. Both Air Canada and flybe - British European give high Y-fare customers a voucher for food and drink on check-in on flights where food is sold. That includes the QuickCheck and WebCheck-in check-in processes, where the voucher is printed - looks similar to a boarding pass.

On BMI top tier Frequent Flyers receive free catering on presentation of their membership cards.

So the technology or processes are there, which is why I am still surprised DJ hasn't offered something similar.

[Arthur T]

Regarding StarClass on domestic, I think it it could work by removing 1 row of seats and increasing the legroom to 34" for the first six or so rows. StarClass could also offer the centre seat free with movable armrests. The manufacturer of JQ's current seat, Brice, also makes convertible seats. When not being used for StarClass (and I agree it would not suit all flights/routes), Jetstar could sell the seats as extra legroom seats. I think it could work - and Jetstar, I believe, have proven to be quite adaptive when it comes to maximising revenue and custom.

Oops! :eek: Think that's the difference bewteen CityFlyer right?
I just feel surprised there is no pillow/blanket on all DRW and CNS flights, as sectors like MEL - CNS or MEL - DRW etc is not short though.
Another wonder is why Hobart and Darwin is not part of QF's CityFlyer destinations?

About StarClass, I agree some routes such as Prosperine or Hamilton Island does not require any StarClass or even 1 or 2 StarClass seat, in the case JetStar can even raise their JetFlex fare for those extra legroom convertables.
However 6 rows seems too much, 2 rows is enough (Rows 1 & 2)

Regarding DJ's Premium Economy, think Australia cannot afford a full Business Class flights bewteen cities, but sounds there is a lot of room for Virgin Blue to enhance their service, make it a bit more luxary or reasonable to compete with QANTAS's business class. But I recoknd at some point QF's business class might be hurt by DJ for some extent.

If NZ's FF system can capable into *A, is there possibity for Velocity to join *A in the future? :confused:

[Michael Morrison]

If NZ's FF system can capable into *A, is there possibity for Velocity to join *A in the future? :confused:

Of course there is - one small problem - Air NZ blocking them!

[Justin L]

Of course there is - one small problem - Air NZ blocking them!

Why is Air NZ blocking DJ's entry into Star Alliance? Is it due to domestic competition within NZ?

[Bruce Bramwell]

Why is Air NZ blocking DJ's entry into Star Alliance? Is it due to domestic competition within NZ?


Classic case of I am bigger than you, I tell you what I can and can't do?

[Arthur T]

Classic case of I am bigger than you, I tell you what I can and can't do?

But aren't Star Alliance long for their *A airline in OZ again after Ansett's failure?

Then DJ can consider SkyTeam then ;)

Anyway, if NZ thinks they are bigger than DJ, then why not NZ buy DJ straight away?

QF has their service in NZ so I don't think that is a problem actually.

[Rhys Xanthis]

DJ is very profitable in NZ at the moment from what i hear - they are undercutting ANZ by a fair amount last i heard.

If they were to come into the Star Alliance Allicance i'm sure it would come with an agreement about the termination of some DJ services to/from/within NZ, something i don't think DJ would be too fond of doing.

[Justin L]

If they were to come into the Star Alliance Allicance i'm sure it would come with an agreement about the termination of some DJ services to/from/within NZ, something i don't think DJ would be too fond of doing.

But if DJ were to join, couldn't Virgin Blue only join, with Pacific Blue and Polynesian Blue not be a part of it? The same way LAN Ecuador and LAN Argentina were not originally part of oneworld (only the then LAN Chile, now LAN)?

[Arthur T]

But if DJ were to join, couldn't Virgin Blue only join, with Pacific Blue and Polynesian Blue not be a part of it? The same way LAN Ecuador and LAN Argentina were not originally part of oneworld (only the then LAN Chile, now LAN)?

Then members of Velocity can actually get points on both Vigin, Pacific and Polynesian Blue flights + *A, unless you terminate Velocity members can gain points on Polynesian and Pacific Blue, which DJ don't want to.

Then how about DJ to join SkyTeam?

[Michael Morrison]

But if DJ were to join, couldn't Virgin Blue only join, with Pacific Blue and Polynesian Blue not be a part of it? The same way LAN Ecuador and LAN Argentina were not originally part of oneworld (only the then LAN Chile, now LAN)?

I'm sure DJ would have them all enter at the same time - esp as they all have the same DJ airline code.