Emirates 413 Engine Failure

[Arjun M]

Emirates 413 did a Pan call on departures about 10 mins ago. Failure of #3 engine on T/O. Is returning to sydney, possible holding for dumping fuel.

[Arjun M]

They just decided to hold and dump fuel for approx 30 min.

[James Smith]

Flightaware has EK413 flying over Port Stephens at 19,000 feet and gradually turning south now over water.

[Stuart Trevena]

Aircraft is A6-EDA.
Currently holding 19,000 feet, heading towards Mudgee, after a circle of Newcastle, still dumping fuel.

Why didn't Airbus build into the A380's a dump valve, instead of wasting time flying around to burn of the fuel?

Also, given that EK413 has declared Pan, are they still allowed to land after Curfew? If so, what conditions are placed on the Pilot? ie Reverse Thrust?

Stuart

[Stuart Trevena]

Now turning South Back to Sydney Airport, on Desent through FL170

Stuart

[James Smith]

Returning towards Sydney now. Will they be fined for breaking curfew? I presume with the Pan declaration that curfew and thrust reverse restrictions will be cancelled. Also, does the full RFFS operate after 23:00? They have probably remained on duty seeing the call was made just after 22:00.

[Stuart Trevena]

About to Pass Penrith at 10,000 ft
Stuart

[James Smith]

Passing 10,000 on descent and abeam Broken Bay.

[Chris Z]

The A380 can, and does dump fuel. Because of their weight ex SYD to DXB, there is a significant amount that needs to be thrown overboard and burnt to get it to MLW.

[James Smith]

Turning base now.

[James Smith]

12 miles on final now.

[Stuart Trevena]

Airport on Local Standby - Fire Tenders 2,4,6 & & 7 on Standby

Full Length roll out Rwy34L Requested.
EK413 Touched down at 23:37

Stuart

[James Smith]

Safely landed 34L and stopping abeam bay 3 to be checked out by the tenders.

[Kurt A]

Just watched it exit safely.

[Stuart Trevena]

Include Tender 5 in my List

[Chris Z]

..and Stuart, they have declared an emergency, so no restrictions on reverse thrust.

[Raymond Z]

Should be no restrictions whatsoever. According to this paper:
http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/aviation/environmental/pdf/airport_curfews_general_information_fact_sheet.pdf

'What about emergencies?
The curfew does not apply to aircraft involved in emergencies
such as air ambulance, search and rescue or critical mechanical
malfunctions.'

It looks like departure is now pushed to Monday morning 7am according to the Sydney Airport website.

[Mark Harrington]

I was on the flight, was probably a compressor stall or something similar....was a loud bang with a small amount of yaw....the plane won't be going anywhere for a while.....just spoke to some ground crew and it needs a new engine!

A once in a lifetime experience!

[Sarah C]

Rego was EDA, 380's with A as their last letter are having an interesting run.

[Radi K]

2nd EK A380 engine problem this week

http://avherald.com/h?article=458d2f36&opt=0

They also had a B777 shutdown an engine over India this week.

And a major engine shutdown a few weeks back in Zambia on the A330

http://avherald.com/h?article=457d2a82&opt=0

From memory they had 2 A380 incidents in a few days back in Oct resulting in multiple tyre bursts in Jeddah and Tokyo.

[Grahame Hutchison]

If they need a replacement engine, do they have a 5th pod option on the A380 (can't recall seeing this used). Would they use an Emirates Cargo flight, or do they need a heavy lift Ilyushin ?

Either way, a number of days will be involved here. New found partner Qantas can't help either, as QF has Trent 900s and Emirates GE/P&W GP7200.

[Sarah C]

No 5th pod so a replacement will have to be brought in. Would the engine fit in the 777 freighters they have operating here?

[Kent Broadhead]

Does sound like a compressor stall from the press reports. Scary for passengers, of course.

Keeping to the EK theme rather than starting a new thread, was there a go around for the 777 flight arriving from NZ around 1745 yesterday?

[Rowan McKeever]

Is there a recovery plan to continue EK413 on to DXB? I'd been hearing the flight would depart again at 7am today and thought perhaps EK412 would turn in SYD back to DXB rather than continue to AKL, but EK412 SYD-AKL shows as departed for this morning?

[Trevor Sinclair]

Would they wait for a replacement engine at YSSY, or fly it back to DXB, devoid of pax, on 3 engines?

[Grahame Hutchison]

UAE419 does play back on Webtrak as a go around (start Webtrak at 5:44pm)

http://webtrak.bksv.com/syd

[Andrew M]

Media at it once again...........

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/emirates-a380s-in-a-sydney-mid-air-engine-explosion/story-e6frf7jo-1226514824688

DISTRESSED passengers told how they survived a mid-air emergency last night

[Kent Broadhead]

UAE419 does play back on Webtrak as a go around (start Webtrak at 5:44pm)/URL]

Thanks Grahame, that's it. Was out in the backyard and wondered why it wasn't under takeoff thrust. Go around at 1744 according to webtrack, I assume due to the A321 takeoff prior.

[Steve McGinley]

Was sitting on the front verandah with a cold one, doesnt matter how many times I view a go around, its always a specatular sight and sound.

[Jeff N]

So what was the outcome for 500 odd stranded passengers at Mascot at 2330 last night?

Also, where is the plane situated now, and is there any word yet on whether it is a short or long term visitor?

[Andrew M]

New engine required

[Sarah C]

There were accomodated on EK services during today - they were all accomodated overnight at a hotel (where required) and I guess they were given whatever space was left on EK today and possibly into tomorrow

[Nigel C]

Parked on Bay 72 near General Holmes Drive.

[Brian Wilkes]

Well you guys can expect a AN124 in the next few days with the engine!

[Andrew M]

I just listened to the ATC of this event, and I am curious why would the pilot even considering continuing onto Dubai, after the loss of one engine ?

[Nigel C]

Well you guys can expect a AN124 in the next few days with the engine!

Why? Wouldn't Emirates just bung one in the B777F?
I've never seen an An124 bring in QF A380 donks.

[Jayden Laing]

Will it fit through the door of the B77F Nigel?

[Stephen Brown]

http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=409004

Heaps of room

Thanks to the Craig Murray!!!!

[James S.]

That's on a 747F where they probably loaded it through the nose. (you can see the raised height compared to the back indicating it's at the front 'hump' area of the aircraft) Still doesn't answer the question of whether they can get it in through a 77F door, as it has no nose loading. So we may just get an EK 747 which we don't normally get again! :D

[Hendra Barnes]

Sounds good. I would like to have the opportunity to capture an EK Cargo B744. Please keep us all updated if it does happen. Crossing my fingers it won't happen over the weekdays, but it would most likely be. The weekend is too far away for EK to wait on.

With regards to EK419 B77W yesterday - I was at the airport yesterday and did not witness any go-around. EK419 arrives at about 17.30-18.00, right? If so, she did overfly the airport quite low (about 5000ft or so). At the time, we had a runway change, which may give the impression of a go-around, perhaps?

Just to clarify, was EK419 operated by A6-ECP?

Regards,
Hendra

[Grahame Hutchison]

The diameter of the GP7270 engine is 124in, and the main front door of the Boeing 777 Freighter is 124in high in the centre of the door (but only 120in on the left and right side). Throw in the transportation pallet and there is no way it will fit.

B777 Freighter Specification From Boeing (http://www.boeing.com/commercial/startup/pdf/freighters/777f_cargo.pdf)

GP7270 Specification From GE (http://www.enginealliance.com/en/specifications/GP7270.aspx)

[Nigel C]

Is that diameter before or after the engine cowling is added? I imagine the cowling width would take up a little bit of space, perhaps enough to allow for it to go on a B777?

Time will tell. Thai flew their B747 out on 3 engines recently, United have done it on 3 out of Sydney. Maybe Emirates will do a 3 engine departure for Singapore then onto Dubai?

[Radi K]

With regards to EK419 B77W yesterday - I was at the airport yesterday and did not witness any go-around. EK419 arrives at about 17.30-18.00, right? If so, she did overfly the airport quite low (about 5000ft or so). At the time, we had a runway change, which may give the impression of a go-around, perhaps?


Pretty sure it did a go around :cool:
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/UAE419/history/20121111/0355Z/NZCH/YSSY

[Grahame Hutchison]

The fan idameter is 116in Nigel, so allowing for the fan surround and palet, I don't think it will fit through 124in.

[Sarah C]

Please EK, send your 747 freighter :)

[Stefan Perkas]

Evening all,

Looking at Ek sky Cargo's flight schedules it appears Sydney could be in luck. It is showing a SYD-HKG flight tomorrow operated by a B747-200 (I think it is supposed to say 747-400).

It is is only showing departure time of 1510. I do not know where it is coming from and what time. I am only providing info based on what the schedules are showing.

I do stand corrected on this. If it doesn't turn up I do apologise...

[Winston Khong]

Awesome, will keep an eye out for it on FR24. Thanks for the info!

[Montague S]

think they'll send the horse freighter.

[Nigel C]

There are 2 Emirates cargo flights due tomorrow. EK4849 due in at 1440 from Dubai, and EK9822 due in at 1820 from Dubai-Singapore. As of a couple of hours ago, they were both listed as being B777's...

[Morris Biondi]

both listed as being B777's...

Unfortunately, EFG and EFD. EFG from VCBI, maybe that is the extra service UAE4849.

[J Brown]

For what its worth, the 777 freighter has a wider main deck door.

Back when all the Trent 900's (so not EK relevant) were being inspected post -OQA incident, a number of new units arrived into Sydney for Qantas onboard 747-400 Freighters. It was extremely tight getting them out of the main deck door, just millimeters either side.

[Winston Khong]

Will these freighters depart this evening? Weather is rather rubbish at the moment. Does anyone know what the second freighter is coming to.Sydney for? Horses for the races?

[NathanJ]

A6-EDA was missing from bay 72 this afternoon. Anybody have info on it's current location/status? Flightradar etc have it's last movement listed as the 11th.

[Jayden Laing]

I would assume its in a QF hangar Nathan awaiting its new engine that should have been flown in today..... That is of course if the extra EK B77F was bringing an engine!

[Grahame Hutchison]

A6-EFG (http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/middle/5/9/7/2150795.jpg) EK4867 14/11/2012 18:06 Emirates B777-F1H - Just departed and is heading back to Hong Kong.

A6-EFD (http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/middle/6/3/5/2075536.jpg) EK9822 14/11/2012 18:28 Emirates B777-F1H - 23min out of Sydney

[NathanJ]

Cheers Jayden, Figured that could be where it's got to, given it hasn't slipped under the radar limping home on 3 engines!

[Sarah C]

The aircraft is in a QF hangar - just visible from QF drive

[NathanJ]

Thanks Sarah!

[George G]

it is undergoing an engine change as we speak.

Qantas engineers are assisting.

[Nigel C]

In Hangar 416

[NathanJ]

A6-EDA was still hanging out in 416 this afternoon. Quiet amazing to see the tail of an Emirates aircraft in place of the usual Qantas heavies and in light of recent events i suppose this couldn't have happened at a more convenient time...? Have there been any past instances where the Qantas Jetbase has accommodated major repairs on other airlines aircraft such as this one?

[Fred C]

Many times over the years Nathan.

A Pan Am 707 that overran was repaired in H191
A Pan Am 747SP that broke its wing landing gear on landing.
BA, Thai, Evergreen, MAS cargo and many others I cannot recall engine changes.
ATA cargo and JAL sheetmetal repairs.

These are only the ones I can remember. There are many many more over the years.

An engine change isn't considered a major repair. Just another maintenance task albeit a heavy one.:D

Why do you consider it a convenient time for Emirates to have an engine change?

[NeilP]

Why do you consider it a convenient time for Emirates to have an engine change?

Referring to EK metal in a QF hangar, I'm gonna go with : the new alliance?

[NathanJ]

Bingo!

[Michael Cleary]

Many times over the years Nathan.

A Pan Am 707 that overran was repaired in H191
A Pan Am 747SP that broke its wing landing gear on landing.
BA, Thai, Evergreen, MAS cargo and many others I cannot recall engine changes.
ATA cargo and JAL sheetmetal repairs.

These are only the ones I can remember. There are many many more over the years.



I think that the Ansett 743 that landed with the nose gear up spent some time in the Jetbase afterwards too.

[David C]

Can anyone confirm whether the faulty engine was take off the wing prior to the delivery of the replacement, and thereby enabling the faulty one to be transported back to Dubai on the same aircraft which delivered the new one ?? ..

Dave C

[Nigel C]

I don't think it was.

[Noel White]

I think that the Ansett 743 that landed with the nose gear up spent some time in the Jetbase afterwards too.

No it didn't go near the Qantas Jetbase. It was repaired in the hangar (can't remember its number) which stood in Google Earth -33.936208,151.182179.

Only the nose was in the hangar. The a/c was well and truly tied down to huge concrete blocks on the apron. The worry was that the a/c could be effected by the strong southerly winds that frequent that apron.

The usual access roads in that area were closed and temporary ones were marked to keep vehicles well away from the area. Sorry, don't have photos - pre digital camera time.

[Nigel C]

Looks like the old Hangar 83 site

[Fred C]

David. They usually keep the off going engine handy until the engine change is complete. It is a useful item for spare parts required. Spare engines rarely come with all parts fitted. They are robbed from the off going engine. Obviously only the serviceable items.

[Andrew Coggan]

Looks like A6-EDA will depart this afternoon at 16:00 as EK7413 to DXB.

FlightAware (http://flightaware.com/live/flight/A6EDA/history/20121117/0500Z/YSSY/OMDB)

[NathanJ]

A6-EDA currently on tow out of the jetbase.

[NathanJ]

Parked at the freight terminal now.

[Paul Hunter]

Lining up now on 34L to depart.

Regards.

[David Heath]

Just departed from 34L...

http://d.pr/i/M7rn

[Brad Varney]

EK 7413 at FL 200 all engines working well now. :)

[NathanJ]

A6-EDA chilling with it's new pals earlier this afternoon...

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8206/8192900514_d670389894_b.jpg

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8059/8191814217_9a058fe174_b.jpg

[Trevor Sinclair]

Did any of our colleagues ascertain the cause of this?

[Jayden Laing]

Hi Trevor,
I was told it was a contained high pressure turbine blade seperation (similar to QF32).

[Mick F]

Hmmm, I'm not sure that I'd say that it's 'similar' to QF32. VH-OQA's engine failure was an uncontained high pressure turbine DISC failure. Very different to a blade failure.

Mick

[Jayden Laing]

Oh ok.... Thanks Mick! I'm no engineer (or along those lines) but thanks for the clarification!

[Mick F]

Neither am I, but you're welcome, :-)

[Mark Grima]

Final report released today.

http://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/investigation_reports/2012/aair/ao-2012-150.aspx

Cheers

M